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RE: Do You Have Shoulder Twitching or Slight "Chicken Wing" Movement Like Me?
Hi there,

I finally found out one of the main causes of my inconsistency. 

I noticed sometimes I will involuntarily twitch my throwing shoulder or what they call the "chicken wing" movement - my shoulder will flap out slightly and hence it caused that dart to travel right across the board.

How do you solve this issue? It came to me like involuntarily and it was an observant friend that pointed out. Is there a way to position our elbow to "lock" it in or does a certain stance help?

I'm using the pencil grip by the way.

Thanks!

Dan
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I do it sometimes but I think its more because of my shoulder injury and not a lot I can do about it as it happens with my hand too Guests cannot see images in the messages. Please register at the forum by clicking here to see images.
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Would love to find a solution. A training regimen or something. My problem is similar and have been struggling with it for a year now. Will throw great one dart and the next my elbow rotates out and I get the left to right scatter. Just cannot seem to correct this.
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Boards: Gladiator 2 with Target Vision lighting system and Gran Board 2 soft tip with Target Corona lighting system. 


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seems like quite a fair bit of us having this issues. So any experts out there who can give some tips? It's really frustrating at times...
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I know a lot of the pros and amateurs alike advocate a slightly angled stance at the line with the same foot forward that corresponds with your throwing arm.

Many of them also like the forearm straight up and down and mainly in line with an imaginary line from the center of the 20 to the center of the 3 with the upper arm parallel to the floor.

I am a strong advocate of keeping the throw and release as simple as possible with no extra movement besides bring the dart back, extend the arm to the board and follow through after release. I like to call it my KISS method of Keep It Simple Stupid. The less extra motion in the throw, the less can go wrong.
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(11-20-2016, 08:37 AM)Dumbeedum Wrote: Hi there,

I finally found out one of the main causes of my inconsistency. 

I noticed sometimes I will involuntarily twitch my throwing shoulder or what they call the "chicken wing" movement - my shoulder will flap out slightly and hence it caused that dart to travel right across the board.

How do you solve this issue? It came to me like involuntarily and it was an observant friend that pointed out. Is there a way to position our elbow to "lock" it in or does a certain stance help?

I'm using the pencil grip by the way.

Thanks!

Dan

I get the odd one now and then but I have reduced the number by practicing.  Specifically, the A1 drill from Flight School.

When I'm doing this drill and my throw's not right I start to concentrate on a few different things.  That is, I force myself to do them mindfully as it's not happening automatically.

The things I may need to concentrate are:
  • Keeping my body still.  In my throw the only thing that should be moving is my arm.  This stops my shoulder wanting to come across and force the dart high and/or left.
  • Pushing my hand straight through to the target.  This seems to stop my elbow coming up in what I think of as "The Shot Putt" delivery.
The key for me is knowing my throw and specifically practicing it.  I don't believe that all practice is practicing your throw.

Darts: Harrows Glen Durrant Duzza Series 2 24g, short Harrows Supergrip shafts, Harrows flights (Marathon/Retina/Optix/Rapide) 


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Hi Banz,

thanks for the tips. When you say pushing helps to reduce the "chicken flap", so does that means your release of dart is much later during the forward arm throw?
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(11-21-2016, 10:20 AM)Dumbeedum Wrote: Hi Banz,

thanks for the tips. When you say pushing helps to reduce the "chicken flap", so does that means your release of dart is much later during the forward arm throw?

I do not (and , indeed, cannot) think about the release point.  My mind doesn't work like that!

I'm just concentrating on the movement of my hand.  The release happens when it happens but I find that by focussing on my hand, it stops other bits like the shoulder getting involved.


I think the key is to know what your throw feels like when it's good and not just for it to be good when it's good but a mystery when it's bad.

Darts: Harrows Glen Durrant Duzza Series 2 24g, short Harrows Supergrip shafts, Harrows flights (Marathon/Retina/Optix/Rapide) 


Best 501: 13 darts (League), 14 darts (Pro Darter)

Best Checkout: 154 (League), 160 (Pro Darter)
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Hi

I've been thinking about that for some time.
As all in darts, there is no such thing as a unique or simple answer. As each one of us have different bodies and minds, the solution for one rarely is a solution for the other.
What I have observed in me and in other players is that the whole configuration of your throw (stance, grip, position, pull back, release and follow through) must be organic and work in harmony.
For instance, I discovered that my grip was somehow not natural. I was making a lot more effort than needed. That would make me swing forward to force my release. Which also made me lose my follow through and I would snap the dart.
But before I noticed it, I tried to fix my stance, moving from side to side, pulling the elbow inside, or turning the torso in order to keep the shoulder under my right eye. You see? That and more I tested needlessly, when I could just change my grip a little.
That gives the picture of what I am trying to say. Perhaps you are just holding your darts too tight. Perhaps you are elevating too high your elbow. And it might be making your shoulder tired and you relax it a bit, by making that wing-like movement. Maybe you just need more practice to gain muscle force. I don't know.
So what would be the solution I can offer? Try to figure out with attention what is it that is felling more unnatural, uncomfortable. What is it that is making you tense or contract your shoulders or neck. Did you choose an easy to keep and repeat stance? Or do you try something that requires precision balance? Remember, you should be rock solid. Don't worry if you do not stay at the oche as MvG does. (I actually think his stance style is unnecessary. But who am I to say?)
And a last point.
I've noticed many people trying to copy great players. They are inspirational, I give you that. But do not try to copy. Even though I think there are a set of 'rules' that would help you improve your game, there are also variations. So, if you don't feel comfortable playing 'by the book', pick your own variation and go for it. And from then on stop think about your throw. Aim. Spot the target. Shoot. Don't think. Let it go. Go back and try again, your way.
That's it.
Some ideas.
I hope it helps.

Skywalker

Enviado de meu SM-G935F usando Tapatalk

My lightsaber: Bull's Mamba 97 24g
My blaster: DPC Golden Guns 23 g
My astrodroid (helps me when I need it): Bull's Pegasus 24g
My ship: Short
My wings: Standard / Harrows Click / Condor

My dart collection: https://flic.kr/s/aHskHdPmnt

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I know after going to the gym for a while I was throwing well but as I was picking up other injuries I stopped going and my throw went bad for a while, its slowly got okish again but I think I was throwing more smoothly while going to the gym.
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(11-21-2016, 01:22 PM)Skywalker Wrote: Hi

I've been thinking about that for some time.
As all in darts, there is no such thing as a unique or simple answer. As each one of us have different bodies and minds, the solution for one rarely is a solution for the other.
What I have observed in me and in other players is that the whole configuration of your throw (stance, grip, position, pull back, release and follow through) must be organic and work in harmony.
For instance, I discovered that my grip was somehow not natural. I was making a lot more effort than needed. That would make me swing forward to force my release. Which also made me lost my follow through and I would snap the dart.
But before I noticed it, I tried to fix my stance, moving from side to side, pulling the elbow inside, or turning the torso in order to keep the shoulder under my right eye. You see? That and more I tested needlessly, when I could just change my grip a little.
That gives the picture of what I am trying to say. Perhaps you are just holding your darts too tight. Perhaps you are elevating too high your elbow. And it might be making your shoulder tired and you relax it a bit, by making that wing-like movement. Maybe you just need more practice to gain muscle force. I don't know.
So what would be the solution I can offer? Try to figure out with attention what is it that is felling more unnatural, uncomfortable. What is it that is making you tense or contract your shoulders or neck. Did you choose an easy to keep and repeat stance? Or do you try something that requires precision balance? Remember, you should be rock solid. Don't worry if you do not stay at the oche as MvG does. (I actually think his stance style is unnecessary. But who am I to say?)
And a last point.
I've noticed many people trying to copy great players. They are inspirational, I give you that. But do not try to copy. Even though I think there are a set of 'rules' that would help you improve your game, there are also variations. So, if you don't feel comfortable playing 'by the book', pick your own variation and go for it. And from then on stop think about your throw. Aim. Spot the target. Shoot. Don't think. Let it go. Go back and try again, your way.
That's it.
Some ideas.
I hope it helps.

Skywalker

Enviado de meu SM-G935F usando Tapatalk

Thanks Skywalker!

Great tips. You made me think I might be focusing on the wrong aspect. It could be something else like my grip that is causing my flapping. I need to really experiment and find my most comfortable stance and grip so I can be as natural as possible. 

Sometimes I feel that leaning forward makes me tires easily as my back aches. So it makes me wonder is this the right stance for me.

Danny
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(11-21-2016, 03:05 PM)Getagrip Wrote: I know after going to the gym for a while I was throwing well but as I was picking up other injuries I stopped going and my throw went bad for a while, its slowly got okish again but I think I was throwing more smoothly while going to the gym.
If I stay away from darts for some time due to job, family or anything else, when I came back, I feel my back, my shoulder and my elbow aching. I feel I need to get my muscle back to work.
This takes some time. But it's essential for me to work my muscles to get back at my game. 30 minutes a day is enough. And working out really helps. Specific training at the gym helps a lot. I carry a red ball I keep squeezing to work my arm muscles. It prevents the pain I feel when I resume playing.
But there are 2 different things we must be able to distinguish: pain caused by lack of practice or muscle strength and pain caused by bad stance, wrong grip, harsh throw etc. These conditions also tend to make your game even more stressful to your body.
I am completely against over training. That's the worst think ever happened to me. I actually injured myself. But a regular training is necessary for physical development. I came to believe that many of the snapping movement that get in the way of our game is due to muscle fatigue.
Nevertheless, one thing is for certain: if you feel any pain, just STOP.
Check your technique. Try to figure out what your are doing wrong, uncomfortably.
Stretch your arm.
I know it sounds exaggerated. But it really worth it.

Enviado de meu SM-G935F usando Tapatalk

My lightsaber: Bull's Mamba 97 24g
My blaster: DPC Golden Guns 23 g
My astrodroid (helps me when I need it): Bull's Pegasus 24g
My ship: Short
My wings: Standard / Harrows Click / Condor

My dart collection: https://flic.kr/s/aHskHdPmnt

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(11-20-2016, 05:31 PM)gumbo2176 Wrote: I know a lot of the pros and amateurs alike advocate a slightly angled stance at the line with the same foot forward that corresponds with your throwing arm.  

Many of them also like the forearm straight up and down and mainly in line with an imaginary line from the center of the 20 to the center of the 3 with the upper arm parallel to the floor.

I am a strong advocate of keeping the throw and release as simple as possible with no extra movement besides bring the dart back, extend the arm to the board and follow through after release.    I like to call it my KISS method of Keep It Simple Stupid.    The less extra motion in the throw, the less can go wrong.

Haha i call this way of throwing almost the same."stupids way".i started call it like this douring my trainning .it was a day that i deside to make my throw more simple.btw my shoulder move so bad when im throwing that i started to feel pain .that happened since some months .now is a little bit better but still moves a little bit or by time to time.i have to concetrate a lot so as to keep averaging more that 60 and that makes me tired.
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