Learning your outs
Coming from soft-tip I always had the board to tell me my outs. I also played OI\OO so I didn't have to worry about doubles.

I am wanting to take the plunge and join the higher skill league that plays DI\DO. The boards will still tell me outs but I also want to start messing around with webcam darts more when I get a webcam mounted. So I need to learn my out shots so I don't have to use an out chart every throw or consulting the board I just know them.

Besides straight memorization of an out chart what other games or practice routines can I use to learn my outs?

I've hear of picking an out and closing it in 3 darts you succeed you go up a point and try again. You fail you either repeat the out or go down a number.

I've also heard of playing 170 to help with your math and your outs.

Besides those two games and memorization what other tricks can I use to memorize these and bring my game to the next level?
Watch a boatload of Youtube videos and pay attention to what the pro's do when they get to an out. Pay CLOSE attention instead of just watching. But do not watch any video with Mervyn King or Phil Taylor. Guests cannot see images in the messages. Please register at the forum by clicking here to see images.
yeah. phil is the best player ever, but leaves himself a lot of non-finishes.
If you go the video/Youtube route watching videos of MvG has highly educational value IMO.

MvG seems to be the best at setting up shots, he never seems to struggle with counting and i don't remember him ever pausing to ask "what 's left?"

Other than that if you don't mind a bit of reading you can give this link a try: https://www.dartbase.com/howtheprosdoit.htm

Even though there may be other routes to go in some outshots than those given in the link, it helped me a lot to get a basic grasp of WHAT to shoot for and WHY.

Memorization will only get you to a certain point. However, to really know your outs, i think you need to also know the best way to continue if your 1st dart misses. Another thing to learn is how to go about an outshot with 2 vs 3 darts in your hands.

What i did at first was pick 10 numbers (e.g 40-50) and close them. Ok maybe the range 40-50 is easy, but people who don't know their outs could go for 20's when left with 46...So, once this gets very easy, add another 10 numbers (50-60), then another 10 (60-70). Continue until you have done all numbers up to 100. Of course you don't need to do all numbers in one day. You can do 10 numbers a day, or according to how much time you have available.

The goal is to close each number with 3 darts. At first maybe you 'll be frustrated, and will probably have to pause and do the math, but persist and you 'll improve rapidly. I tried this for a couple of weeks and afterwards i felt much more confident with my counting.

It would also help to know the various combinations of "triple-double" or "triple-single" of the board by heart.

For example
T20 - D20 =100
T19 - D19 = 95
T18 - D18 = 90

(see the pattern there? just go down by 5 for each number)

Or these:
T18- S18 = 72
T19 - S19 = 76

and so on..
Ignore the "how you are doing it" in favor of "where you are sending it."
One of the first things you can do to simplify things is try and work on odds/evens.

If you have a 76 left, you know you're going to be throwing at another even number to give you an even out.

If you have 79 left, you know you're going to be throwing at an odd number to give you an even out.

Since you come from a soft tip background, try and put yourself in a position to at least have a 50/DB outshot.

Like if you have 126 left, don't go for a T20. You always want to think, "If I miss that triple and hit a single, do I still have a chance at a double?"
If you throw at T20 with a 126 and hit a single 20, you now have 106 left...and no two dart combination.
Now if you throw at a T19 instead and hit a single 19, you have 107 left. Now you can try going for a T19 again...and if you do hit it, you have 50 left for that double bull shot.

Learning the 100-130 range is critical...especially if you're a soft tip player that's comfortable shooting at bullseye.

This link is also really helpful...the guy goes into reasons for choosing different paths.

Also, start practicing up on standard double combinations.

Like throwing at D20, D10, then D5
Or D16, D8, D4, etc..

D16 and D20 are two of the most important doubles in darts (and the bull)...so it's important to get consistent on those specific numbers if you expect to win.

Also practicing those combinations will give you an idea of what you prefer. Like if you have 45 left, some will throw at a 5 to give them a D20 while others will go 13 for a D16. It's all preference. Of course you want to be able to hit all doubles but it's nice to have a fair bit of confidence towards one or the other.
Thanks all. Lots of good information to work on.

Does anybody with both a soft tip and steel tip background use two different out paths? Using Regulatori's 126 example. I would shoot B - B - D13 in soft tip since the whole bull counts for 50 not just the double and not even think about T20 or T19.
and thinking about t19 or t20 is what i'm here to learn Guests cannot see images in the messages. Please register at the forum by clicking here to see images.
(07-25-2015, 10:59 AM)Balin Wrote: ... to really know your outs, i think you need to also know the best way to continue if your 1st dart misses.

Exactly -- when that first triple turns out to be a single, you don't want to break your rhythm by stopping to recalculate. You need to already know.
26's so far this year: I've already lost count. :-)

Learning your outs then learning to properly set up shots is the hardest thing about playing 501 properly imo.
Playing a lot of 101 with a recommended out shot card by my side really helped me when I was first starting.
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Match Darts: 23g MasterDarts Gold MVG's or Gary Anderson phase 3
Highest out 155 (T-19 T-20 D-19) Guests cannot see images in the messages. Please register at the forum by clicking here to see images.
2015 180's Goal Progress: 108/180

Interesting to read. This is one area of my game im struggling. Recently found my self on a 3 dart checkout staring at the board working out what i needed. I then heard a voice from a guy sat on the table shouting out what i needed. Whilst i apriciated the help it left me a bit embarressed.
Im going to try the 170 method hopefully memorise a few 2 and 3 dart finishes.
Here's something I posted a while back that covers approaching an out: https://www.dartsnutz.net/showthread.php?tid=9222

This one starts at 315, but I've seen some online that will start from 350, as a 180 will leave you on 170.
- If it don't fit, force it.  If it breaks, it needed replacing anyway.
- If it ain't broke, you might still be able to fix it.

"Maintain a solid 60.  What you do with your other two darts is up to you" -Unknown

My match darts:  22gm Bulls White Pegasus, intermediate nylon/Target Carbon Ti Pro stems, Rhino standard flights.
Which outshots to learn first? In my opinion, that will depend solely on your level of play. What tends to happen with the newer player is that the pressure of trying to make the big outshot overwhelms accuracy. So, if you're throwing at 40 points/throw (PPT), there is not much point in worrying about the 130+ outshots. It is quite possible that your PPT will drop once you start trying to take out the big numbers rather than just knocking down the score. ( Your mileage may vary, but that's what I've noticed in these parts...)

Suppose you throw an average of 40 PPT or less, you will need to get down to 60 or less before you have a solid chance at making the outshot. So, I would start with learning the outshots from 40 to 60.

As your averages creep up, you'll tend to see more outshots above that range. So, you'll need the next range of 60-80 under your belt.

Of course, there is nothing wrong with knowing the 2-dart outshots that end on D20, D18 and D16 that use the big triples. Know them, and go for them, but you'll fare better knowing the lower outs first. Afterall, when you are going for bigger outs, you will often be shooting in the 40-60 range with two darts in hand.....
What would you recommend for a player with a 66 PPT average on soft tip and a 40 PPT on steel tip? Stay with the 40-60 range? Since I think its a lack of outs\doubles that is hurting the steel average. Or try and expand the range to include 40-80 so as to cover both averages?
I'd first learn the 40 - 60. Then the 60-80 group has a solid foundation.

eg. You have 65. Many people go SB + D20. You miss SB. If you know 45,46,47....60, your next shot is automatic and more likely to succeed. 65 is nothing special, try 67 = T9 + D20. Miss the T9. You are now under 60. Your shot may be S? + D20. If you do not know 40-60, you'll be struggling to arrive at the right number while thinking on the oche under pressure, and less likely to hit it.

When learning these outs, I recommend that you shoot for them. So start at 41 and stay on the number until you finish it in two or three darts. Then go to the next higher one. If you have not gotten to 60, stop after 20 minutes and take a 5-10 min break. Pick up where you left off.

Another approach is to practice in groups like 40-50, 50-60, 60-70 etc. or smaller groups like 40-45, 46-50 depending on your skill level. Taking a break after each group.

The smaller group can make sense especially above 60. As your accuracy goes up, the time it takes to do the group goes down, so groups of 10 or more become realistic.

The benefit of shooting for them is that when you know them, you won't have to do the math -- you can just switch targets.

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