Unicorn

Is "Understacking" a real thing? Or a Sid thing?
We all know Sid used to love talking about Taylor and his "overstacking" and "understacking."

In case you're not into pro darts, Phil Taylor throws darts that stay level in the board. He can often put a dart low on the T20 bed and set the other darts on top...he'll often use that first dart as a marker and bounce/slide the other darts off that initial dart.

Barney won the bull (starts first) in the sudden death round of the 2007 World Champs by overstacking...Taylor threw a dart right below the bullseye and Barney put one right above it (many say Barney's dart glanced off Taylor's into the bull).

I do understand "overstacking."

But what about "understacking?" Sid used to mention this quite often how Taylor would both employ this technique and how Barney later copied him.

It simply means throwing a dart high in the T20 bed and your other two darts lower to deflect off the first dart downwards.

Taylor is what....5'6-7" or 1.7-ish meters. The T20 is a few inches above his head....I can see him possibly "understacking" because he uses smaller flights and throws more directly at the board (doesn't float his darts).

But Barney? The guy is 6'3"
How could he possibly understack? Yes, his darts land flat but I just can't see how it's physically possible.

Do think it's one of those Sid-isms or do you think understacking is a real thing? Seems to me it's just a bit of Sid's enthusiasm for the game rather than a true technique.
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Well "understacking" would be better for people who's darts land flight up, like Gary Anderson, right?

I've heard different pros say it "makes the target bigger."

I agree with that. Put a dart at the top of the triple 20 with the flight standing up a little. Next dart can hit anywhere between the bottom wire of the triple and the flight of the dart (this could be a target of more than an inch depending on how steep the darts is in the board) and have a good chance of scoring another triple.

I see your logic though, even more-so on the triple 19. It always surprises me how blocked it looks, but pros will keep throwing at it (and hitting it a lot of the time).
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If you want to see Sid mention both understacking/overstacking a lot, watch the 2007 World Champs...it's an incredible match regardless.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MflRzjTMC9M
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0iwAtaj3TyI

The aspect ration is messed up on youtube, makes it look squished...I would recommend using a free program/app to save the youtube files and then open the videos up in VLC media player. Then manually change the settings in "video" > aspect ration to 2.21:1

Much more enjoyable to watch.
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I just made a video of myself the other day. First time I played darts in months. And I understacked 2 darts for a 140 on video. My darts land very flat so normally i would of gone for the cover shot after the 1st dart landed high.
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I see no reason why it can't be done almost as easily as overstacking. Look at Anderson and Lewis how their darts land with a bit of an upward slope at the rear. If they hit above the T-20 or high in the treble, it is easy for them to deflect off the first dart to make the others have a better chance to get in the T-20 also.

You'll notice how Phil almost always moves down to the T-19 when his dart lands just above the T-20. Phil's darts have just a slight downward slope to the rear many times and the flight will be in the way of the T-20, thus the need for his great cover shooting. Justin Pipe's darts also land with a bit of a downward slope to the rear. Both of them have little problem overstacking, but more of an issue understacking because of the angle of their dart in the board.

I can see your point with taller players having a harder time doing this. But I believe it all depends on how the dart lands in the board more than anything else. Maybe it just pays to be a shorter player sometimes.
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Dmont...
The problem with an angled dart is that it's more difficult to slide under another dart. It has to come in an absolute perfect entry angle. With flatter darts, the tip is usually angling upward/tail down right before it hits the board...so your darts have more a wider area to bounce off the other barrel.



Cyanide....
How tall are you? Mine land flat/slightly tail down and I'm around 5'9"-5'10"

I rarely have luck understacking but it also could be the darts I use (shark grip)..they tend to get crazy deflections.
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(04-30-2015, 12:04 AM)Regulatori Wrote: Dmont...
The problem with an angled dart is that it's more difficult to slide under another dart. It has to come in an absolute perfect entry angle. With flatter darts, the tip is usually angling upward/tail down right before it hits the board...so your darts have more a wider area to bounce off the other barrel.



Cyanide....
How tall are you? Mine land flat/slightly tail down and I'm around 5'9"-5'10"

I rarely have luck understacking but it also could be the darts I use (shark grip)..they tend to get crazy deflections.

Same height as Phil. Short. I warmed up with him on the same board back in 1996. If you see my "broken leg 140" vid you'll see some under stacking.
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(04-30-2015, 12:04 AM)Regulatori Wrote: Dmont...
The problem with an angled dart is that it's more difficult to slide under another dart. It has to come in an absolute perfect entry angle. With flatter darts, the tip is usually angling upward/tail down right before it hits the board...so your darts have more a wider area to bounce off the other barrel.



Cyanide....
How tall are you? Mine land flat/slightly tail down and I'm around 5'9"-5'10"

I rarely have luck understacking but it also could be the darts I use (shark grip)..they tend to get crazy deflections.

Maybe Im missing the point but I dont see the difference between Taylor overstacking or Gary Anderson understacking. Garys darts land parallel to eachother in the board, Phil Taylors due too, but they are just at different angles. So when Phil has a dart with the tail hanging down, his next dart (right before it hits the board) is going to be at the same angle. When Garys darts stand up in the board, his incoming dart is coming in at the same angle. In both scenarios the incoming point/barrel/flight can hit the other point/barrel/flight that is stuck in the board and deflect into the triple.

Phil Taylors margin for error would be missing low, he still has a chance at deflecting into the triple. Gary Andersons margin for error would be missing high.
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I'm 5 ft 6, and my darts land completely flat if I use pears or phil taylor flights. I like a slight upward tilt though, so tend to use kites.

I see no reason understacking would not work.
Started playing darts: Mid February 2015.

Darts used: Not having played for a long while, I am leaning towards my 23 gram eagles. 

180's:18 Since I started Mid February 2015. I stopped playing for a long period due to stupidity. Back to the learning process again, but am enjoying it. 
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I had a minute so I drew this up. I could be wrong but it makes sense to me. I think all of these "darts" have a chance of going in the triple 20. Gary would switch if he missed low, Taylor would switch if he missed high. (edit: dartboard and arc not to scale, unless you through at a giant dartboard or stand 3 feet from the board haha)
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I think my throw pretty much lands at the angle of the arc, so I have darts overstack and understack. Sometimes I think this can cause bigger deflections though.
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Here is a quick screen shot of Taylor's throw.

The first line is the T20 spot.
The second line is Taylor's height...roughly 5'8" (Taylor is leaning forward)
The third line is the exact height Taylor releases the dart.

Broken link(s) removed



If you watch the full video of him throwing, you'll notice the dart's trajectory never rises above the T20. It rises up towards the T20 and then the tail dips down before landing in the board.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl...13AY#t=156

If you watch the slow motion video and watch the dart against the background poster, it never rises above the small printed section....which is around the T20 height.

Basically his drops don't drop into the board...they fly straight and then tip up at the last moment. That's how I see how he's able to understack...he never has to worry about coming down/deflecting off a dart unless he chooses to throw higher.
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If you go to 5:15 of that video you can see his darts go above that text, and the triple 20 is below the text also. He would have to throw really hard to not have his dart drop at all.
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Don't know about that Reg. Phil's darts go a lot higher than you think.

Broken link(s) removed
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I like to use my own version of this its called "SPORADIC STACKING"
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From last night

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