Cricket Player's Playing 501
I've always been told you should be able to hit every double from where you stand and ive always applied this to every segment on the board not only double ... if theres a blocker dart or something and youve got no choice but to stay ... a scoring example if your on 230 and youve hit S20x2 and have 190 left you have no choice but to stay on 20s to leave 170 so that might warrant moving to the right or the left dependant on the lay but i cant see why youd move when throwing at different numbers with nothing blocking you
Reply
(11-19-2014, 04:41 PM)brenthahn Wrote:
(11-19-2014, 04:26 PM)Cyanide Wrote: Moving around doesn't build any sort of consistency.

Standing right in front of my target every time means I'm throwing straight ahead every time. And the board's the same distance away every time. You've still got the height variable, but a couple of others are eliminated. What about that doesn't encourage consistency?

But hey, I've got an open mind; I'm willing to listen to reason here. And all those TV dart pros can't be wrong. In fact, I'm even going to spend some practice time today standing in one spot and trying to discern whether I've been wrong all along.

I'll get back to you :-)

OK, I've just done about 20 minutes or so of standing in one spot. I think if I were more of a "sideways" guy, it would be easier. But I'm not -- I'm closer to a "straight-on" thrower. Partly because it's easier on my back, and partly because I need to turn my head a little to get my left eye in the correct spot. But it means that if I'm standing in front of the bull and throwing at the lower left, like D16 or D8, my ribcage gets in the way of my arm. Disaster. It doesn't make as much of a difference on the right side of the board, which makes sense. Although my shots at 18 and 15 were landing a little low, which also makes sense.
26's so far this year: I've already lost count. :-)

Reply
Sorry, to get off topic of cricket players and 501, but after reading the few above posts I could not resist asking about one point of moving on the oche.

I am in my second year of playing darts and when I started throwing I stood looking straight at the board then I was told that I should try standing sideways to see how that works. Well, I tried it and liked it after I was able to get my knee in the right spot so there was no pain. So for about a year and a half I have been standing sideways but I have always moved left or right according to what number I was throwing at.

After watching the videos on how to throw darts one of the past world champs said line up a little to the left so you arm is in line with the bull and 20. I took this to mean line up with whatever you are shooting at, so I move left for 12 to 16, maybe only 2 inches left for the 19, and then right the same amounts for the numbers on that side. Therefore I am always trying to throw straight ahead not at any angle.

If I would try to throw at all numbers from the center spot then the left side might be something possible but I have tried throwing to the right side and it causes pain in my knee or ribs and causes wild shots because I am facing the other way by being sideways and I would have to twist my body or hand to hit the right side. So why not just move right and throw straight?

I know what the pros do however I could not hold a dart like them nor do I have the talent they are born with. I have also joined FS and there was never any mention on standing in one spot and hitting all numbers. If it was implied it went right over my head otherwise I was just not aware that moving along the oche was a no no. When I watch people in my league they stand in all different locations and shoot with different types of throws so everyone is somewhat different.

To get back on topic most players in my league (USA, New Jersey) seem to like Cricket because it makes you hit certain numbers and those of us that can't hit numbers lose. 501 is looked at like a race to lower your total score and only hit the one main double when going out. The double in can be on any double which gives a chance of a lower player like myself a chance to hit one by accident and also get a high score by accident not on purpose. In cricket you have to hit certain numbers to close or score and if you can't then the advantage is with the player that can and scoring points can change what the other player shoots at. This is probably why most don't think about that cover shot mentioned above because the players are thinking about scoring in a different way then a true 501 player probably does.
Reply
(11-25-2014, 05:55 AM)trekbowl300 Wrote: Sorry, to get off topic of cricket players and 501, but after reading the few above posts I could not resist asking about one point of moving on the oche.

I am in my second year of playing darts and when I started throwing I stood looking straight at the board then I was told that I should try standing sideways to see how that works. Well, I tried it and liked it after I was able to get my knee in the right spot so there was no pain. So for about a year and a half I have been standing sideways but I have always moved left or right according to what number I was throwing at.

After watching the videos on how to throw darts one of the past world champs said line up a little to the left so you arm is in line with the bull and 20. I took this to mean line up with whatever you are shooting at, so I move left for 12 to 16, maybe only 2 inches left for the 19, and then right the same amounts for the numbers on that side. Therefore I am always trying to throw straight ahead not at any angle.

If I would try to throw at all numbers from the center spot then the left side might be something possible but I have tried throwing to the right side and it causes pain in my knee or ribs and causes wild shots because I am facing the other way by being sideways and I would have to twist my body or hand to hit the right side. So why not just move right and throw straight?

I know what the pros do however I could not hold a dart like them nor do I have the talent they are born with. I have also joined FS and there was never any mention on standing in one spot and hitting all numbers. If it was implied it went right over my head otherwise I was just not aware that moving along the oche was a no no. When I watch people in my league they stand in all different locations and shoot with different types of throws so everyone is somewhat different.

To get back on topic most players in my league (USA, New Jersey) seem to like Cricket because it makes you hit certain numbers and those of us that can't hit numbers lose. 501 is looked at like a race to lower your total score and only hit the one main double when going out. The double in can be on any double which gives a chance of a lower player like myself a chance to hit one by accident and also get a high score by accident not on purpose. In cricket you have to hit certain numbers to close or score and if you can't then the advantage is with the player that can and scoring points can change what the other player shoots at. This is probably why most don't think about that cover shot mentioned above because the players are thinking about scoring in a different way then a true 501 player probably does.


So much going on in that response. I'll try to keep it quick and just focus on the highlighted part. Imagine Phil Taylor for a second. He has 76 left. He steps to the oche and hits a single 20. At this point he doesn't take a step to the left and line up to hit a single 16. He just looks over at the single 16 and hits it to leave 1 dart at tops.

Now imagine an American cricket player needing 1 20 for points and 1 16 to close. This is what I see all the time. The player will throw a 20 and close it. Stop. Move over to the left. Then hit a single 16. See the difference there?

It's my strong opinion that moving around like this slows the game WAY down and doesn't develop any sort of rhythm needed to play top level darts. It just doesn't work.

I live a really sheltered life as far as darts is concerned. I haven't been out in years so I really haven't seen many people play live. All I've seen are the pro's play on live streams week in week out. So I get used to watching how they play. Lately I've been out to a few leagues and a couple tourney's and my mind is boggled at how much people are moving all over the place. Shuffling all over the oche trying to force darts into a segment they don't need to hit. And it's not just one person doing it. It's nearly everyone.

I know a lot of you guys play local leagues. I'd be curious to know what people do in different parts of the world. I'm kind of wondering if all this moving is just associated with people that play cricket the majority of the time. Here in my area, it's the norm to move all around. So I'm guessing others wouldn't even notice? Weird though.
Reply
A lot of it sadly does have to do with players wanting the elusive "ton" rather than paltry 97.

In our leagues we get extra points regarding ranks for every ton+ hit. I play in the middle league and still see it all the time. Last match I was playing doubles with my partner that also plays in the top league...I hit two 20's but they were right above the T20 wire...plus we were on a 179 so instead of going for that last T20, I did the cover shot for a 120 or 82 and barely wired outside the T19. My partner was shocked a bit..."I figured you would go for the glory...just about everyone does."

To me rankings doesn't matter. I know for a fact I'm easily in the top 1-2 in the league the number of 97s...but that's a score that never makes it on the rankings sheet. Oh well.

I also think soft tip players are obsessed with controlling the 20s at all costs...so when they move into steel tip, it becomes habit.

I also very rarely move on the oche. Only case is when I have everything closed out in cricket and going for bulls...and one of my darts happens to hit right below the wire low/tail up blocking the bull from my position.
Reply
How much of it is not so much being a cricket player, but the players first experience with darts being soft tip and now playing steel or now also playing steel? Playing soft tip darts I see this A LOT.

Since there is more room for another dart a player will continue to throw at the segment even though it is blocked. But want to take a different angle on it.
[Image: SOFTWCWx2_zpscc38cb56.png]
Reply
But maybe it is just a thing done just because of cricket...

Paul Lim at 12:20 in this video.

[Image: SOFTWCWx2_zpscc38cb56.png]
Reply
(11-25-2014, 06:19 AM)Cyanide Wrote: Imagine Phil Taylor for a second. He has 76 left. He steps to the oche and hits a single 20. At this point he doesn't take a step to the left and line up to hit a single 16. He just looks over at the single 16 and hits it to leave 1 dart at tops.

Now imagine an American cricket player needing 1 20 for points and 1 16 to close. This is what I see all the time. The player will throw a 20 and close it. Stop. Move over to the left. Then hit a single 16. See the difference there?

It's my strong opinion that moving around like this slows the game WAY down and doesn't develop any sort of rhythm needed to play top level darts.

That is my belief as well. Moving is just another distraction.
Reply
I usually move a little when im throwing with a raised oche but if im just throwing at home or somewhere with a level floor line I wont move so I stare are my target.
Reply
A GREAT example to this thread is Leonard "Soldier" Gates. Recently I watched him play and win a Dartslive event. It was extremely painful to watch him play cricket. A lot of pausing and stopping and basically taking FOREVER and a day to get to the oche, throw 3 darts and get out of the way. And when I say painful to watch, it was right up there or worse then Scotty Kirchner and that awful phantom throw. The Dartslive video is out there, give it a watch.

But I watched a stream the other day of the latest CDC event where he played in the final. I have to say it was an absolute joy to watch and he produced some awesome darts including a match winning 157 checkout for a 12 darter. I believe he was playing DJ Sayre and they went along at a fantastic pace. No pausing and no stopping at all. It was bam, bam, bam get out of the way and repeat.

This is what America needed in the worst way. Quality darts that's enjoyable to watch. Both players averaged low to mid 80's and it was nice to see them play so well. This match contained none of the habits you see in cricket matches with all the moving around the oche, and the general slow pace of the matches.

I've been watching the stats since the beginning of the CDC and have noticed the averages creeping up at every event. In just a short time our North American players are improving. There's some seriously good darts being played. I truly believe with every ounce of my soul that if this continues we'll start seeing more American players compete in the world circuit. Long format 501 is the key to improving your overall dart game. It builds the consistency and rhythm needed to develop a players skills to the max. I can't wait to see where the CDC and Darts Connect takes us. But I'm liking what I see.
Reply
I have seen many players that will move their whole body by tilting forward or back depending on wether they are throwing at numbers high on the board or lower down ie T20 or D3 and will as you say move side to side to be directly infront of the number they are going for and it baffles me why.
Is their throw so rigid they cannot adjust or do they feel as though their co ordination from hand to eye is flawed.
As for cricket players just going for the cover I feel that may be just the "monkey see monkey do" as they have not played 01 regularly against more experienced player's and would pick that up very quickly after seeing the benefit of smashing other trebles instead of sticking to 20's when blocked.
Apart from when I am blocked I stand in the same place and rely on muscle memory
[Image: GEpKdcf.png] 
Current Board 
ONE80 Gladiator 3 with Corona Surround and Unicorn number ring
Darts
Modified Unicorn Striker with RD medium sparkle stems, hardcore  charcoal flights and Target titanium stem rings   

Playing 40 years on and off and still barely average
Reply
I used to move all over the board but I personally have found that its easier and more consistent for me to stay in one place. I can twist at the hips just a fraction and line up all over the board.
Reply
All you need to move is Throwing Arm, when either collecting new Dart or moving Arm to throw the Ruddy thing; and slight movements of the head... other than that Stay still.
Reply
I'll give just moving the arm a shot today in practice
Reply
(08-09-2015, 03:11 PM)Stalker Wrote: I'll give just moving the arm a shot today in practice

Then I will be more Bodily specific. Primarily you need to concentrate on Moving the Fore-arm only through the line of sight to your intended target... Keeping your Hand, Fore-arm, Upper-arm & Shoulder as relaxed as possible, train your self to use only necessary muscles to launch the Dart.
Reply


Possibly Related Threads…
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Playing Cricket & Bullseye's Banned 7 1,896 11-05-2014, 11:01 PM
Last Post: Banned



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)