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Not usually one to raise a fuss, and I’m not trying to start anything, just curious on other players thoughts.

Why is there such a huge gap between soft tip and some steel tip players? To me the game is the same no matter what you throw, “Darts is Darts” but There’s a type of steel tip player that thinks soft tip is just a mockery of steel tip... I just don’t understand it...some people view soft tip darts as an unrelated part/group of the game? 

The number one reason I hear is that soft tip is easier than steel... which i believe to be false, (yes, the board is smaller. And I completely understand that) but a good soft tip player can still shoot very well and maintain a damn good average on a bristle board. I have seen it proved on a bunch of occasions.

I have also been told that “your not a real dart player”, because my darts are just “child’s toys”, or I have had people ask what I throw when I throw “normal” darts... 

it just irks me every time!

Looking for any opinions or discussions...

Also do Any other soft tippers have any stories of this? Or any discriminating phrases that your tired of hearing?
"Not a real dart player" and "child's toys"...
I think what you are describing does not say anything about any flavour of darts but rather about the people uttering such nonsense. Whether one likes it or not, the world is full of idiots whose brain capacity is exhausted by breathing. There is no point in trying to have a meaningful conversation with those types.
I could elaborate and bring up comparable examples but it would only get me banned...
Play both steel and soft tip myself and I've heard/seen plenty.
If it bothers anyone my advice is, grow a pair. Rolleyes
I think you need to grow thicker skin if that gets your goat so much. If you like soft tip, then by all means enjoy your games on the board and let the steel tip players have their opinion, whether you believe what they are saying or not------obviously not by the tone of your post.

I'm not a fan of soft tip, have no desire to play it, and actually know of no place in my city that has a soft tip machine to play on, but for the folks that enjoy it, more power to them.

I've seen some soft tip matches on u-tube and I think what gets me most is the amount of gear soft tip players have attached to their belts and that ridiculous "Phantom Throw" many of them do, kind of like a golfer taking multiple practice swings before really getting on with it. Oh, and the silly noises the machines make would not go over well with me as I find that stuff distracting. If I wanted noise from machines when playing something, I'd go play the slots at the local casino.
I could care less about soft tipped darts. I do not dislike them at all, I just do not want to start collecting them, on top of what I already have fun throwing. I started with steel and will always play steel and like Gumbo says, the noise is distracting to me as well. But, it's the rage in Taiwan, where I used to travel once a year.
I do get the odd comment about soft tip in a discord group i'm in, but I discussed it in a civil manner due to the fact that soft tip is so dominant in Asia, so I decided to compete in it just to get experience. But if anyone wants to discriminate, I give them the finger and tell them to shove it. No sport should have room for any form discrimination.

With that said, I'm proud of my achievements so far in Dartslive, and a third place in a steel tip tournament.

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk
Interesting that you posted this. It's something I've been thinking about quite a bit lately; not necessarily the discrimination part, but the perceived differences between soft and steel tip darting. While I wouldn't classify what I see as discrimination necessarily, I do believe the two are viewed differently. And while I am (at the moment) strictly playing soft tip, I can't wait to get my steel tip board installed and get started down that road as well. I too believe there are some aspects of soft tip which make it "easier" than steel tip.

One thing to consider is tradition. I think some people believe steel tips is where it started and that's where it should stay. Maybe those people feel soft tips are the red headed step child of the sport. I see their point, but as the world evolves and adapts, so must we all. Soft tip play generates income in ways that steel tip play cannot. So, from what I can see in the US, bars and pubs use it to generate income rather than relying on alcohol sales from steel tip play. It's similar to coin-op pool tables versus 9 foot Brunswick's (or ten foot snooker tables). I think there is a similar view from snooker players versus pool players...

Things that make soft tip play easier; larger segments, outer ring of bull is worth 50 rather than 25, and darts land in a straight-on position 97% of the time, and there's no doubling out.

Those four things alone are massive game changers...remember, I'm a soft tip player, so no hating on me.  Blush

I felt "sheepish" posting pics of my 180s (at first) in the Show your 180 thread, worried if I would be given grief as a soft tipper. If you peruse the thread, there aren't that many soft tippers posting pics in there. I like to be a trendsetter.  Rolleyes  I know it's easier for me to hit maximums on the soft tip board as opposed to a steel tip board, and I don't pretend that it's not. As of today, I have had over 220 maximums since January 1st. Do I think that number would be the same if I had been playing steel tip instead? Nope. I sure don't. Do I believe I will get there eventually once I switch over to steel tip? Yes I do...but that's my own confidence level in how I'm progressing - I've only been throwing seriously for a little over a year.  Wink

The bull area is not only a game changer when it comes to racking up points in 501 as the entire area is worth 50, but it's a game changer with HOW one plays their outshots. When playing soft tip, there's not OPTION of 25 points with one dart...that can really come in handy in numerous situations.

Darts landing in a straight on position is a HUGE advantage in my mind. For soft tippers, it doesn't matter at what angle the dart enters the holes, because of the actual nature of the holes, they align the darts straight (minus a few times when flights get crossed and bends the soft tip and the dart into the awkward position. In steel tip, the dart stays in the position in which it enters the board. When darts are straight on (e.g. Phil Taylor's darts) it eliminates a tremendous amount of blocked shots which do not have to be worked around. This is why I've focused on Phil Taylor's throwing style - and subsequently Peter Wright's.

One of the biggest differences is doubling out. Averages are higher for a lot of soft tippers (myself included) as we don't have to double out. That's just off the charts advantageous.

I love soft tip and will continue playing it. I am also eager to get my steel tip board mounted right next to the soft tip and we'll see how that goes...but knowing me, I'll put whatever time and effort is necessary into that, as I have the soft tip. I anticipate frustration and eventually satisfaction.   Smile


As far as the "child's toys" comment...I believe it is far more difficult to throw a lighter dart accurately than it is a heavier dart. Isn't that why steel tippers generally throw darts far heavier than the 20 gram maximum weight allowed in soft tip play? Just sayin'...   Big Grin


Great thread topic, and just my  2cents
(04-11-2020, 01:38 AM)SlingBlade Wrote: [ -> ]I just do not want to start collecting them, on top of what I already have fun throwing.

That's one advantage soft tippers have...we can just throw a set of conversion points in and WALLA, two sets of darts in one! Smile LOL

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lol - hard to top Jamsgolf's post and a lot of good points!

For me, I never forget the regard shown to Paul Lim by the PDC's best.  You win that sort of respect on the board.  Talk is just talk, but part of the game.  Doubt if any of your bad actors would tell Paul Lim soft tip sucked.  Wink

I don't play soft, but folks I respect do.   Much better players too! Tongue 

cheers...
(04-11-2020, 12:37 AM)Great White North Wrote: [ -> ]Play both steel and soft tip myself and I've heard/seen plenty.
If it bothers anyone my advice is, grow a pair. Rolleyes

I play both as well, love both of my boards, and both styles of darts. 

I can deal with people ribbing on me... I mean it bothers me a little, 

but what bothers me that people who say that kind of stuff, are spouting on about it on Facebook groups, while attending tournaments or sadly even at youth tournaments.... I can’t help but feel like it’s keeping some people from even trying the soft tip side, because they have been filled with the idea that soft tip is just a joke.
One thing I've learned is when people have to spout their mouth and put others down, is because they themselves feel insecure in some way, shape, or form...

Bullies are cowards on the inside...always have been and will likely always be...
(04-11-2020, 02:16 AM)JAMSGOLF Wrote: [ -> ]Interesting that you posted this. It's something I've been thinking about quite a bit lately; not necessarily the discrimination part, but the perceived differences between soft and steel tip darting. While I wouldn't classify what I see as discrimination necessarily, I do believe the two are viewed differently. And while I am (at the moment) strictly playing soft tip, I can't wait to get my steel tip board installed and get started down that road as well. I too believe there are some aspects of soft tip which make it "easier" than steel tip.

One thing to consider is tradition. I think some people believe steel tips is where it started and that's where it should stay. Maybe those people feel soft tips are the red headed step child of the sport. I see their point, but as the world evolves and adapts, so must we all. Soft tip play generates income in ways that steel tip play cannot. So, from what I can see in the US, bars and pubs use it to generate income rather than relying on alcohol sales from steel tip play. It's similar to coin-op pool tables versus 9 foot Brunswick's (or ten foot snooker tables). I think there is a similar view from snooker players versus pool players...

Things that make soft tip play easier; larger segments, outer ring of bull is worth 50 rather than 25, and darts land in a straight-on position 97% of the time, and there's no doubling out.

Those four things alone are massive game changers...remember, I'm a soft tip player, so no hating on me.  Blush

I felt "sheepish" posting pics of my 180s (at first) in the Show your 180 thread, worried if I would be given grief as a soft tipper. If you peruse the thread, there aren't that many soft tippers posting pics in there. I like to be a trendsetter.  Rolleyes  I know it's easier for me to hit maximums on the soft tip board as opposed to a steel tip board, and I don't pretend that it's not. As of today, I have had over 220 maximums since January 1st. Do I think that number would be the same if I had been playing steel tip instead? Nope. I sure don't. Do I believe I will get there eventually once I switch over to steel tip? Yes I do...but that's my own confidence level in how I'm progressing - I've only been throwing seriously for a little over a year.  Wink

The bull area is not only a game changer when it comes to racking up points in 501 as the entire area is worth 50, but it's a game changer with HOW one plays their outshots. When playing soft tip, there's not OPTION of 25 points with one dart...that can really come in handy in numerous situations.

Darts landing in a straight on position is a HUGE advantage in my mind. For soft tippers, it doesn't matter at what angle the dart enters the holes, because of the actual nature of the holes, they align the darts straight (minus a few times when flights get crossed and bends the soft tip and the dart into the awkward position. In steel tip, the dart stays in the position in which it enters the board. When darts are straight on (e.g. Phil Taylor's darts) it eliminates a tremendous amount of blocked shots which do not have to be worked around. This is why I've focused on Phil Taylor's throwing style - and subsequently Peter Wright's.

One of the biggest differences is doubling out. Averages are higher for a lot of soft tippers (myself included) as we don't have to double out. That's just off the charts advantageous.

I love soft tip and will continue playing it. I am also eager to get my steel tip board mounted right next to the soft tip and we'll see how that goes...but knowing me, I'll put whatever time and effort is necessary into that, as I have the soft tip. I anticipate frustration and eventually satisfaction.   Smile


As far as the "child's toys" comment...I believe it is far more difficult to throw a lighter dart accurately than it is a heavier dart. Isn't that why steel tippers generally throw darts far heavier than the 20 gram maximum weight allowed in soft tip play? Just sayin'...   Big Grin


Great thread topic, and just my  2cents
A lot of Great points in here!! I agree with about 90% of your points, but also disagree with a point or two.. but it’s just different opinions Smile 

also one thing I didn’t consider was the skill of the player who plays both, or is trying to switch from one to the other.. I think someone who is a beginner would definitely find soft tip considerably easier than steel. But more advanced/pro soft tip players would find both boards very similar... when I switch back and forth, I usually can’t tell a difference, other than the way my darts actually land...but my average stays about the same, (maybe a 2-3ppr difference at the most)

Im glad I got so many replies! Im happy to see everyone’s point of view on the subject Smile I love all aspects of darts, so I just hate seeing people rejecting us soft tippers as part of the darts “family” if you will Smile
Another point I usually argue is that it’s not as easy as some think...Phil has played the last 2 Years in Japan, I remember hearing ol Phil taylor say that the superdarts tournament in Japan was one of the toughest competitions he’s played in... in 2018 he played very very well, but i think Boris, or haruki beat him in the final 4, but still one hell of a tournament!
(04-11-2020, 03:08 AM)Mac-attack99 Wrote: [ -> ]I think someone who is a beginner would definitely find soft tip considerably easier than steel. But more advanced/pro soft tip players would find both boards very similar... 

Fantastic point right there!  Smile

(04-11-2020, 03:15 AM)Mac-attack99 Wrote: [ -> ]Another point I usually argue is that it’s not as easy as some think...Phil has played the last 2 Years in Japan, I remember hearing ol Phil taylor say that the superdarts tournament in Japan was one of the toughest competitions he’s played in... in 2018 he played very very well, but i think Boris, or haruki beat him in the final 4, but still one hell of a tournament!

Haruki should have beat everyone...he has the sexiest darts on the planet!  Big Grin
(04-11-2020, 02:45 AM)nixer55 Wrote: [ -> ]lol - hard to top Jamsgolf's post and a lot of good points!

For me, I never forget the regard shown to Paul Lim by the PDC's best.  You win that sort of respect on the board.  Talk is just talk, but part of the game.  Doubt if any of your bad actors would tell Paul Lim soft tip sucked.  Wink

I don't play soft, but folks I respect do.   Much better players too!  

cheers...
The aura Paul commands just being in a room is... amazing. I learned so much from him, and is a trailblazer for the soft tip scene in Asia.

Steel tip on the other hand, it's still recovering after a former head of the steel tip association here took the money and ran off. Paul and a few others managed to get some funding for a new one and now we have a regular steel tip league, it's bigger than Phoenix Darts now, though its still small compared to the monster that is Dartslive.

Here it's a very good camaraderie between steel and soft tip players. We understand and learn from one another. There is a team of players from the Philippines who are contenders in both steel and soft tip tournaments, and they are really good players. Plus they're really inviting, asking us if me and my teammates would like to join them for steel tip tournaments. We politely declined, for me it was due to my onset of dartitis at that time.

That's why I was so brazen about discrimination between formats. It's almost not tolerated here in Singapore. They just co-exist because we can learn a lot from steel, and put it in soft tip play and vice versa if you're ballsy enough.

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